Are Teachers Over Paid?by mommytotwo | More from this Blogger 17 Aug 2006 06:22 AM I am having a hard time believing that I even just wrote that in my title. I am a member of another message board and there is a debate going on about school, the debate turned a bit ugly (this is my opinion) when some of the members stated they were tired of teachers complaining about being underpaid. The poster went on to say that she found some information that the average teacher pay in her state was $42,000 a year. She said after knowing that and knowing how much she makes making minimum wage to support her family, she is tired of teacher's boo-hooing that they don't make enough. I, of course, had to respond to that because I sincerely believe that teachers are grossly underpaid, and I will be more than happy to share why. First off, when a woman was upset that she was making minimum wage while teachers made more and complained, teachers don't make minimum wage for a reason. Who would go to college and get a degree only to work in a field that paid minimum wage? As it is now, the teaching field is losing teachers to higher-paying careers, so I can imagine if teachers were paid even less what would happen. Second, in my experience, after teaching ten years, I resigned. At the time of my resignation, I was making 16,000 dollars a year, part-time. Many may not think that is bad money, and I honestly never complained, but think about it this way: If I were teaching full time, I would have been earning around 32,000 dollars a year. Did I mention that I had been working on my master's and I had 19 hours of graduate credits, which increases your pay scale when teaching? So, with a college degree, 19 graduate hours and ten years of experience, I was making 32,000 dollars a year. Does that seem like I was overpaid? I sincerely hope no one says yes. Let me break it down even more. Yes, I got summers off, but I was paid 12 months out of the year. During the summer, I went to graduate school, which was paid by me, with no reimbursement from my school district. My friend, who is a nurse, makes around 60,000 dollars a year and was shocked when I told her what I was making after ten years of teaching. She has been in nursing as long as I have been in teaching. I have more education than she does, only because I was working on my masters and she didn't. She gets her continuing education paid for, I do not. Matter of fact, I must renew my teaching license and I need to take two more classes to do so. Another 600 dollars or so towards schooling for me. My friend calculated that with as much vacation as she gets in her current nursing job, she gets pretty close to one and a half months off, similar to my having summers off when I was teaching. Yet, she makes $30,000 more a year than I did. Add to the fact that I often purchased school supplies, field trips, paid overdue library fees and bought rewards for my students out of my own pocket. Does it seem like teachers are overpaid when knowing all of this? My frustration stems from people not seeing just how important of a job teaching is. No other career field allows you to touch the future like teaching does. For someone to say that teachers are paid too much and should stop complaining about it, obviously doesn't see what an important job teaching is. That saddens me. Relevanteducation tags User Comments  Heather Long (16954) 17 Aug 2006 07:36 AMTeachers are vastly underpaid and undervalued in our society. My school district raises a lot of money and charges a great deal in property taxes over 75% to go towards our schools. I'd pay more -- if it meant the teachers made it. Brandie (1720) 17 Aug 2006 07:46 AMOkay, I'll be the flip side here ... there are many places where teachers are underpaid. I'll grant you that. But we have teachers in my district making over 100,000. Yes, I value my teachers, yes, I appreciate their hard work - I'm a certified teacher in my state - I know about long hours and grading papers long into the night and all that jazz. But those salaries are not underpaid IMO. I also happen to be in one of the highest paying districts in my state - they are lucky to get jobs here (the district says they get 500 applications roughly for each job opening). Does the average teacher get paid that much? Nope. But there are places where teachers are not being overpaid. And the average salary here is 82,000. Again, I don't think that is underpaid - but please notice I'm not saying overpaid either and I recognize the pay here is not the pay everywhere as well. ;-) I don't think the 42000 you reference here is over-paid either though. Just someone who has said in the past not all teachers are underpaid and I wanted to throw in my 2 cents!  Valorie Delp (49340) 17 Aug 2006 09:10 AMYes, but in those same districts how much does the janitor make? I'm not saying the janitor is not important but here, the janitor is eligible for raises earlier and makes more than the teacher. It is insulting as a teacher to make $60,000 say, when the janitor--who didn't go to college and who didn't have to earn a Master's just to keep his job--makes $120,000.  mommytotwo (526) 17 Aug 2006 09:45 AMThanks for the replies! I too, have to wonder just what other people in your area make if the teachers are making over $80,000 a year. I assume in your area, making $80,000 a year isn't going to get you very far, because the cost of living is so high. Perhaps I am wrong on that. Brandie (1720) 17 Aug 2006 12:20 PMWell my dh doesn't make 80,000 a year and he's managing a data department. I am a SAHM and we have 3 kids ... so I think 80,000 isn't that bad! We support a family of 5 on it =) But we live in a Chicago suburb and cost of living isn't cheap. But 80,000 isn't chump change around here either. As far as janitor goes - I have no clue. All our teacher's salaries are listed on the internet - I can access those very easily. Janitor - not so much. Brandie (1720) 17 Aug 2006 12:26 PMOh, question about the janitors in your area Valorie - do they get the same health care coverage and pensions as teachers? And do they have the same early retirement options as teachers? I know health care coverage here for teachers is wonderful, in my state they can retire at least 5 years earlier, and the pensions, well, wonderful for most teachers. If the janitors are not getting those options that could be the offset for increased yearly salary, kwim? Just a thought! Valorie Delp (49340) 17 Aug 2006 06:12 PMBrandie--You're right in that $80,000 isn't that bad of a salary. But I don't think most teachers start at that anyhow and like I said it's all relative--KWIM? And yes, thanks to the unions, janitors are very, very well compensated in terms of pensions etc. Like I said, I'm not saying janitors aren't important or shouldn't be well compensated. I just think that salaries should reflect, at least in part, the education required to maintain your job. Teachers here are required to a) be licensed (which costs several hundred dollars) b)of course have their bachelor's but also their master's within 5 years and c) participate in ongoing staff development and/or college classes.  babydawn (7008) 25 Aug 2006 04:21 PMI wish teachers were paid more. Teachers are right up there with doctors for me, men and women who save peoples lives. There is no replacement for teachers. Our entire society is built on having a good education. Teachers certainly should get paid more, because of the importance of the job. I always wondered growing up, why professional athletes got paid so much more than teachers. I know the answer now, but it seems ridiculous to be pissed off that teachers "make too much" when others get paid stupid money for NOT adding something valuable to our society. Teachers are priceless and if they were paid a better wage, I would imagine we would get quite a few more candidates who really wanted to be there. I have known people who have really wanted to teach, but have chosen another career path because the wages were too low to support a family on. And it is a shame because we are missing out on some amazing people.  MommySpice (6806) 25 Oct 2006 07:18 PMMaybe I ought to move to Chicago. Here in California, I make $41,000 a year, pay $400 a month for Health coverage. Teachers at the top make around $70,000. Maybe it sounds like a lot to some people, but I can't even qualify for a shack to live in. A small 1-2 bedroom fixer-upper runs $300,000. A decent 3 bedroom, 2 bath house is $400,000 on up. I have a Bachelors degree plus another year for the extra credentialing California requires. I'd love to get my masters, but due to all of the extra work I have to do (its a myth that we get summers off, with all of the extra prep and conferences we have to go to) I have neither the time nor the money. I leave the house at 6:15 am and don't get home until 3:30 or 4:00...and then its only because I brought work home with me. I usually put in another 3 to 4 hours at home. I get 33 minutes for lunch, if I tell my students I can't meet with them. I'm in one of the higher paying districts in the area. I know this is an old blog, but I followed a link here, and I just had to say something! :)  Shannon Stepp (68) 05 Jan 2007 08:41 PMOK, I can't help but respond to this one. I am a 34 year old teacher. I make $41,000 a year to "work my buns off." I have $30,000 in college debt and am required to attend more and more workshops every year. To start teaching, you have to have a Bachelor's degree plus your credentials that can be $10,000-$15,000 more than your degree. I teach high school and it is becoming more and more dangerous every year. Teachers in inner cities like Los Angeles make an average of $37,000 a year. On top of all of that, we pay so much out of our pocket for supplies. I am sure there are teachers out there that make way too much money. That may be a problem within a certain district. Maybe I will feel differently by the time I make that kind of money but for now, I feel like I work hard for my money and don't make enough. By the time I pay my mandatory union dues and retirement, I bring home less than $2700 a month. Then, minus my supplies and I really don't make as much as one would think! Raymond8898 (5) 18 Sep 2007 10:44 AMHello all, I am totally new to the teacher field. Seems there is a big range in the pay scale. Why is that? Also, is there a average pay scale for most major cities? Is the any reference from the Internet?  Courtney Mroch (9169) 18 Sep 2007 02:25 PMI agree with babydawn. I'm not a teacher, but many of my friends are. They are everyday heroes to the kids in their classrooms just like many NFL, NBA, NHL, etc. stars. Yet, where's their million dollar deals? Where's their endorsements? It's shameful what we put money in (and cut money from) and what we totally ignore...those who educate our kids, the ones who will inherit our country. Seems those guiding them should be as well compensated as possible. nynetguy (10) 29 Sep 2009 01:00 PMI created an account here just so I could post this because this is a discussion that I had just yesterday. My position is that teachers, specifically New York City teachers are not only overpaid they are grossly over paid. The starting salary for a NYC teacher with just a BS and no experience is $45,530. Also, teachers are only required to work a maximum of 6.3 hours a day. Yes there are lesson plans to create, tests and projects to grade and parents to discuss but does that actually ad up to an additionaly 2.6 hours each day? Giving the benefit of the doubt that meants that the starting hourly rate for a NYC techer who works 180 days for 9 hours a day is $28.10 an hour. Without the full 9 hours that the rest every other civil servant such as a cop or firefighter works would over inflate that hourly rate to $40.15. So in that regard alone NYC teachers are grossly over paid when one simply compares the total amount of hours they work in a year (1,620 given the benefit of the doubt) compared to the 2,250 hours for other position such as police or firefighter. NYPD starting salary is about $32,000 dollars by comparison. Now, as to the claim that "why would I get a degree for a job that pays inimum wage." The average starting salary for a corporte attorney is lower than that of a cops at around $26,000 dollars. Of course the eventual upside there is that the lawyer will eventually move on to a lucrative private practice where the money is. By contrast the average national sallary for a government attorney position (for 2005) is $46,158. Not all that far away from the starting salary for a NYC teacher with a degree and no experience but when one considers that the average attorney is going to end up working like a dog by putting in 12-14 hour days, sometimes for weeks at a stretch with the fact that the teachers work far less than the base 2,250 hours a year is that in anyway fair? As for continuing on for your graduate degree that the school system did not pay for. Show me any profession that provides this for their personnel please. Sure, some companies offer some form of tutiotn reimbursement but only at a percentage and the degree sought has to be of something that owuld benefit you at the company. Additionally should you leave the company within a certain number of years you are most likely liable to pay the company back for every dime they reimbursed you for. My last company, as an example offered 60% tutiton reimbursement (not covering any books, labs, etc.) for a Master degree but you had to stay at the company for 5 years or pay back every dime reimbursed. I have presented these arguments to a number of my friends who are teachers and not one of them can provide me with a solid, provable argument as to why teachers are underpaid so I put the challenge to you here. Detail the number of hours the average teacher spends on their job. In the school teaching, development days, lesson planning, test/project grading, parent interaction, etc. Break it out so we can see how many hours are allotted to what category. If you can absolutely show that teachers work a full year of 2,250 hours (which is extremely doutful). Second, assuming that you were able to complete the first part above you would then still have to explain why a teacher, who graduated college with soley a BA and has no experience is deserving of a greater starting pay than a college graduate who graduated with a BA, passed the LSAT, got accepted to law school, passed and obtain their law degree, studied for and passed their Bar and then passed their Character and Fitness evaluation. I look forward to either no response or one filled with anecdotal arguments at best. nynetguy (10) 29 Sep 2009 01:02 PMMy apologies but please ignore the 7th paragraph from my above post. Community Tags Shannon Stepp Discuss this article
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